7:25AM
DAYS 1-5 (MARCH 8-12)
The nearly carbon-copy of last week’s weather continues, as a Pacific cold front moves through the region today. After rain showers end, some clearing and a mild afternoon will follow. A stronger cold front follows this tonight with a few rain showers possible again. Cooler and windy weather arrives for Thursday but not looking for wind gusts are ferocious as what we experience last week. However, some trees have been weakened by recent wind and continue unfrozen ground, so they may be vulnerable. Damage and power outages cannot be ruled out. A wave of low pressure will pass south of the region Friday morning but may bring some minor snow accumulation in CT, RI, and southern MA. An arctic cold front will follow this later in the day and evening with the potential for snow showers/squalls, and then a very cold weekend follows. Some records may be challenged yet again.
TODAY: Mostly cloudy with rain showers ending west to east by lat morning, then partly to mostly sunny. Highs 53-60. Wind SW 10-20 MPH with higher gusts, shifting to W.
TONIGHT: Variably cloudy. Scattered rain showers evening. Lows 30-37. Wind W 10-20 MPH with higher gusts, shifting to NW.
THURSDAY: Sun and passing clouds. Highs 41-49. Wind NW 15-25 MPH with higher gusts.
THURSDAY NIGHT: Increasing clouds. Chance of snow by dawn CT, RI, and southern MA. Lows 18-25. Wind NW 10-20 MPH early, shifting to W and diminishing.
FRIDAY: Cloudy morning with a period of snow southern MA, RI, and CT, with minor accumulation possible. Partly cloudy afternoon. Chance of snow showers/squalls late day or at night. Highs 28-35. Wind W 10 MPH.
SATURDAY: Mostly sunny. Lows 7-14. Highs 20-27.
SUNDAY: Mostly sunny. Lows 5-12. Highs 26-34.
DAYS 6-10 (MARCH 13-17)
A complex storm system is possible from later March 13 into March 15 with various types of precipitation. Drier weather follows. Temperatures near to below normal.
DAYS 11-5 (MARCH 18-22)
Dry weather to start the period, then additional storminess is possible favoring the March 20-22 period. Temperatures near to below normal.
Thanks!
First!
Thanks TK !
Thank you TK! That darn uncertainty of storminess in the March 20-22 period is going to drive me to drink. š
here are the models for the tuesday storm
euros ( i have do not have snow map) looks like weak snow/rain event
http://www.tropicaltidbits.com/analysis/models/?model=ecmwf®ion=neus&pkg=asnow&runtime=2017030800&fh=246&xpos=0&ypos=227
Canadian (travels over cape cod/southeast mass.) snow north and west of boston
http://www.tropicaltidbits.com/analysis/models/gem/2017030800/gem_T850_neus_29.png
GFS ( mainly snow storm gets “trapped” south of the region” ) this shows the most snow. and is more tuesday night and Wednesday. So i am guessing the later they system arrives here the better chance for a good snow storm.
http://www.tropicaltidbits.com/analysis/models/gfs/2017030806/gfs_T850_neus_29.png
10-1
http://www.tropicaltidbits.com/analysis/models/gfs/2017030806/gfs_asnow_neus_41.png
Kuchera
http://www.pivotalweather.com/model.php?m=gfs&p=snku_acc&rh=2017030806&fh=192&r=us_ne&dpdt=
I know these are the 6z run of the gfs but since the OOz also had a somewhat similar storm system I posted the 6z.
Here is the canadian
http://www.pivotalweather.com/model.php?m=ggem&p=sn10_acc&rh=2017030800&fh=198&r=us_ne&dpdt=
Here is a re-post from what I posted earlier this morning:
0z 30km Fim also has a monster for tuesday, but with the Warm solution.
https://fim.noaa.gov/FIM/for_web/fim_jet/2017030800 /130/3hap_sfc_f174.png
The gfs snow bomb not withstanding, I think Tuesday could possibly end up with the warmer solution. still plenty of time on that.
Reply
JpDave says:
March 8, 2017 at 7:04 AM
24 hour snow map to go with that (10:1)
https://fim.noaa.gov/FIM/for_web/fim_jet/2017030800 /130/totsn_sfc_f204.png
Hmmm it didn’t copy over the links. I’ll re-post.
https://fim.noaa.gov/FIM/for_web/fim_jet/2017030800/t3/3hap_sfc_f174.png
https://fim.noaa.gov/FIM/for_web/fim_jet/2017030800/t3/totsn_sfc_f198.png
Good morning and thank you TK.
I continue to be amazed at the model outcome spreads, even 48-60 hours out.
It’s either a testament to the complexity of the atmosphere or the deficiencies in
some of the models OR more likely BOTH. I still find it to be utterly fascinating.
I wonder IF the 12Z NAM will finally catch onto the fact that Friday’s system is going South? And if not this morning, when?
I also continue to be concerned that the Tuesday event will feature More RAIN than SNOW, at least in the coastal plain. Still plenty of time on that one, but I am NOT
getting good vibes. Will continue to monitor.
And one last thing. How low will it go this weekend? I am wondering IF it won’t be Colder than last weekend, at least with the overnight temperatures. The lowest I got last weekend was 9. We shall see. The race is on….
Matt Noyes of NBC Boston has a 68% chance of snow for Boston on Friday.
68% chance of snow? What does that mean? one flake? A minimum of
1 inch? 2 inches? That’s a REALLY broad statement. š
Which means a 32% chance of no snow? Or is it 30% with 2% undecided?
Now that the SREF is in range, here is the 12 hour snow for Friday:
http://www.spc.noaa.gov/exper/sref/gifs/latest/SREF_SNOWFALL_MEAN12HR_f057.gif
Ensemble mean: 3.27 inches for Boston.
I believe it was JMA who once stated the the SREF is POLLUTED with the NAM. š
So we have the NAM and now the SREF calling for SNOW, while ALL other models
have the snow suppressed South.
This morning’s NWS discussion re: Friday
Thursday night into Friday into Saturday…Moderate Confidence.
Latest trend in the guidance has trended coastal low a bit northward
towards southern New England. This was indicated from the ensembles
last night. Still looking at the individual ensembles, appears to be
enough clustering to suggest that system could still wiggle a bit
northward bringing more snow to the region. The exact location of
the low will determine where the snow axis will occur. If the low
comes even farther northward then the snow axis will be along
the Pike as the south coast will see more of a mix. If the low
pushes farther south then the south coast will be the only ones
to see snow accums. Right now, where the low is tracking believe
that p-type will remain mainly snow as wet-bulbing will occur
due to good omega within the snow growth region increasing the
precip rates. Still a lot at play still for this system, but
right now it appears that the trend is more snow then prev
forecast so have increased snowfall amounts. May need winter
weather advisories across the south coast.
NWS Likely snow map
http://www.weather.gov/images/box/winter/StormTotalSnowWeb1.png
Potential
http://www.weather.gov/images/box/winter/SnowAmt90Prcntl.png
The 12Z NAM is finally shifting South.
http://www.instantweathermaps.com/NAM-php/showmap-conusncep.php?run=2017030812&var=PCPPRSTMP_2m&hour=054
http://www.instantweathermaps.com/NAM-php/showmap-conussfc.php?run=2017030812&time=PER&var=ASNOWI&hour=063
I don’t know if this is a real possibility or a figment of the Nam’s imagination, but
we “may” have to watch for this little meso low / Norlun type feature. Awfully
close to coastal MA.
http://www.instantweathermaps.com/NAM-php/showmap-conusncep.php?run=2017030812&var=PCPPRSTMP_2m&hour=066
Will get a better look with the 3,4 and 12KM NAMS in a bit.
Check out this 4KM NAM. I have placed a red circle around an
area of “troughiness”. Probably won’t amount to much to much of anything.
http://imgur.com/a/pLZnN
Hardly a big ticket event, but I think 2-4″ of snow on Friday from the Pike southward is a good bet, with some wiggle room on the location.
You think it is coming that far North? Even the 12Z NAM now suppresses it
South.
Curious as to your reasoning on this. Thanks
I think it’ll make it into a good chunk of SNE. I suspect a systematic error across a lot of the guidance while the low, in very weak form, is moving across the Midwest tomorrow. The 12z GFS looks a little better, and the RGEM is much more north.
I knew you had a good reason, I was just curious as to
what it was and I appreciate your response as always.
Many thanks
Let me have a peek at the RGEM.
Oh yeah, big time! Thanks
I wonder how much the Euro will move North?
Did you see the GFS early?
Why do you ask? you say. Well, the 12Z GFS all of a sudden has come NORTH.
This back and forth is DRIVING ME NUTS!!!
http://www.instantweathermaps.com/GFS-php/showmap-conusncep.php?run=2017030812&var=PCPPRSTMP_2m&hour=045
GFS Snow for Friday
http://www.instantweathermaps.com/GFS-php/showmap-conussfc.php?run=2017030812&time=PER&var=ASNOWI&hour=063
Now that the GFS has come North, I think it significantly increases the chances that we see a light snowfall on Friday, Especially MA Pike South.
1-3, 2-4? Take your pick. š
Here is the 12Z RGEM snow map (10:1). Please note, this only goes our 48 hours, so
it would STILL be snowing some at 12Z on Friday, so these would need to be upped
slightly. š
http://www.tropicaltidbits.com/analysis/models/rgem/2017030812/rgem_asnow_neus_16.png
Here is how far North it comes:
http://www.tropicaltidbits.com/analysis/models/rgem/2017030812/rgem_mslp_pcpn_frzn_neus_15.png
Much farther and it introduces RAIN along the South Coast. š
Question:
I udnerstand that the CMC is generally considered TRASH, does one and all feel the same way about the Mesoscale RGEM model that only goes out 48 hours. I get the
distinct impression that the RGEM is held in high regard by the Meteorological
community OR am I dead wrong on that? Thanks
Is the moral of the story regarding the middle of next week …..
If the models can’t consistently nail down something that’s less than 48 hrs away, why should we put any stock into any projection that is 144 to 168 hrs out ??
š š š š
Isn’t that what TK, SAK and JMA have been saying for a long time now????
Still, we are compelled to look.
Thank you, TK.
JPD, if we get snow south of pike, you can come enjoy it here.
Can I send my kids to your house if they don’t have school? š
Of course you can. Flu seems to be gone and my grandkids would love to play with them
š
Regarding Tuesday,
Although the GFS shows a major snow event still, it has backed off just a bit
on the massive snow numbers. Still a very very significant snow event.
Here is the snow map (Kuchera)
http://www.instantweathermaps.com/GFS-php/showmap-conussfc.php?run=2017030812&time=48&var=ASNOWI&hour=186
I looked at the previous runs and this is the 4th consecutive run that shows this major snow event. Snow totals differed on every single run, but it has showed a MAJOR snow event on each run as follows:
18Z yesterday PM
0Z last night
6 Z today early this morning
12Z today this morning
Still not a done deal by any stretch, but one likes to see some consistency, which has
been shown over 4 runs.
Now let’s see IF the CMC and the EURO and to a lesser degree the FIM still show
a WARMER solution as they did on their last run. š
I hope we get zilch
Looking ahead, it appears that we will also have to watch the 17th where a decent
clipper drops out of the lakes and intensifies South of us. So far 500MB looks Awesome
with beautiful support for a good one, however, the 200 mb flow is flat underneath us
and for now, it wants to go mostly due EAST well South of us. It needs to be watched.
Long way out. Plenty of wiggle room. š
Last Friday and this Friday may end up remarkably similar, right down to the inverted trough.
Weird, isn’t it? I wonder if the squalls will be a bit more productive in some
areas this time?
What about the snow from the system? South? It gets in here?
Your current thoughts? Many thanks
Mostly south and not easy to get it to accumulate thanks to March sun angle.
Fwiw…the noontime tv mets now have actual numbers on their snowfall maps. C-1″ from Mass Pike north to NH border and 1-3″ south of the Pike with the Cape/Islands a bit more.
the more snow we see on Friday = the less we see for next weeks storms š
Don’t agree in the slightest on that. It has nothing to do with it this time around.
WBZ has already advertised that we are watching a potential Nor’easter for next week.
because there is a chance, all they are saying. They are saying its a watcher.
I understand that.
Good God.
Only a few more days of early model runs….
Couple tweets from meteorologist John Homenuk
https://twitter.com/jhomenuk/status/839527986097446913
Can’t stress enough, not as easy as saying “Day 6, wait and see”. The atmosphere offers many hints and clues and we can understand them.
So here, we can look at evolution of blocking in high latitudes and understand significance of potential threat is not just “typical”.
Most interesting. Waiting on the Euro
The 12Z Euro may present the most realistic outcome for Friday. Here are the total snow map and surface. We shall see.
http://imgur.com/a/o7ibn
Thoughts? Comments?
One inch sounds good to me!
I think its a 1-3 for Friday south of Boston.
The one to watch is Tues Wed then 12z GFS wants to deliver more snow on St. Patrick’s Day.
So far, the Euro set up for Tuesday AM looks interesting, although it depicts
a fairly weak system:
http://www.tropicaltidbits.com/analysis/models/ecmwf/2017030812/ecmwf_mslpaNorm_us_7.png
Nice set up though. Here is 500mb
http://www.tropicaltidbits.com/analysis/models/ecmwf/2017030812/ecmwf_z500a_us_7.png
Waiting for my service to get out far enough to gauge precipitation.
This “should” take system somewhere in the vicinity of the benchmark give or take.
@ChrisDeVitoWX Another +PNA trend on the Euro this run. This gives us much more room to move. Really exciting look
This was a response from John Homenuk to Chris Devito
Much more room to move where? Geez. Why don’t they say what they mean!
Reason #1 i despise Twitter
JPDave here is a map of EURO from Ryan Hanrahan
https://twitter.com/ryanhanrahan/status/839543979016355840
That looks to be too far off shore, unless the trough goes negative.
This is hour 168, where it has already rocketed by us.
Where is all of this blocking? This thing really motors on by
us and quite a bit off shore, I might add. If you draw a straight line from hour 144 to hour 168, it would traverse our area
SouthEast of the benchmark. So for snow here, it would have
to get pretty potent prettt fast to throw a heavy snow shield this
far N &W. Still waiting.
Oops
144
http://www.instantweathermaps.com/ECMWF-php/showmap-ecmwf.php?run=2017030812®ion=USA&var=PRMSL_msl&hour=144
168
http://www.instantweathermaps.com/ECMWF-php/showmap-ecmwf.php?run=2017030812®ion=USA&var=PRMSL_msl&hour=168
Well perhaps not so far SE of benchmark. Pretty close
maybe???
Euro Surface for hour 156 shows a potent system throwing heavy snow up to the Boston
Area with moderate snow N&W of there or so it looks. This is 7PM Tuesday, 3/14.
http://imgur.com/a/RQfUY
WOOF!!
You bet. That’s more than 1 inch qpf melted for Boston SE
Euro snow map looking very much like the GFS. š Will post shortly. Need one more panel
Maybe this is the one the models see far in advance and they actually stay consistent?? Hasn’t happened in a very long time
We are getting some run-to-run consistency, although the Euro has had this
for 4+ runs, this is the VERY FIRST run that it had a Major Blow out of
a major snow event.
Here is the 12Z Euro Snow for the Tuesday event. this is ONLY the Tuesday event.
This is the 24 hour total between hour 144 and hour 168:
http://imgur.com/a/TdpAY
From this run it looks like the Boston area is in Ground Zero!
That looks like the perfect snowstorm
Is it just me or has anyone else noticed a subtle philosophy shift with BZ weather? Starting this winter I’ve noticed more and more sensationalism and over-the-top reporting and forecasting. It’s starting to remind me of what Ch.7 became. It’s a shame bc I always thought BZ was immune to that and didn’t need the ratings grabbing headlines
I think you may be correct. We have not been watching 4 for about a month now.
We had been watching 5 and didn’t like that.
Now we are trying the new NBC station.
We’re not too pleased all the way around.
But in the Weather department, I’m still OK with Eric and Harvey, but
I don’t watch the entire news program just for weather. I used to, but now
that I have WHW, I don’t need to do that anymore. š
It’s been more than subtle. They have joined the hype parade unfortunately.
They started that last year. I remember commenting on it.
The bottom line is that all media sensationalizes with headlines. It is up to the individual to understand that and read the content. But then that is just my opinion.
FWIW, that Euro depiction at 256 hours has the system centered about as
close to the benchmark as one can get. Benchmark is 40,70 correct?
Look at the previous 156 hour surface of Euro and then click on this link and place
the cursor in what you think the coordinates are of the storm center.
I did it about 5 times. Awfully close to 40,70. Fun exercise.
http://www.findlatitudeandlongitude.com/?loc=northeast+region&id=1176945#.WMBVTNIrK70
Has anyone looked at the CMC for Tuesday? Anemic!
Split personality? How could it be SO FAR OFF from the GFS and the EURO?
I am about to totally and completely STOP looking at the CMC!!
http://www.tropicaltidbits.com/analysis/models/gem/2017030812/gem_mslp_pcpn_frzn_us_25.png
Still no changes for me in my thinking. South and weak Friday and Sunday.
I kind of like the GFS depiction a bit better than the ECMWF for Tuesday / Wednesday. Weaker QPF, but longer duration as the event gets sheared into multiple parts. Not sure what the outcome is at this point, but snow maps are worthless.
Thanks JMA. How confident are you that we get at least a moderate snowfall in here for Tuesday?
*by weaker QPF i mean less liquid over 6 hour intervals and not necessarily more or less in total over event(s) duration.
WBZ on FB winter returns with a vengeance!!! Give me a break they are such a dramatic weather group . Someone looking at that in a rush is going to think all hell is about to break loose .
Hype = viewers = ratings.
Same game all the time.
I personally think Eric is the cat’s meow.
I like Eric a lot but I not a big fan of the wording of their online stuff lately, and the same goes for all of the stations. All equally poor.
The headline actually read…Multiple Snow Threats and Near Record Cold.
I think people should know better than to base anything on a headline. But then that, again, is just my opinion.
I saw a different post on my news feed earlier.
And I agree about what you said, but unfortunately, they don’t know any better. That is one of my major aims – erasing that tendency.
TK, there was a lead in at the top that clearly was meant to catch folks attention. But the headline was also in clear view. If people cannot even read what is in clear view, I suspect they will not read the explanation and, yes, that is a problem. I don’t think it is as dangerous with weather as it is in the current political climate.
http://i.imgur.com/5c2VZZT.png
I don’t see any problem with that as a headline.
It doesn’t say we’re getting the blizzard of the century.
JMA’s 2:09PM post basically said what I wanted.
Still, people will go nuts over snow maps for next Tuesday. Hmm wasn’t it just 2 or 3 days ago that the threat for that day was “non-existent”? Where is the energy for this system right now? Lessons learned in the past? Nope. Long way to go there.
The pattern supports something a little different than some of the model depictions. That in enough is reason for stepping back from these solutions and just acknowledging the threat around that time.
It’s really nice out.
Agreed! I am now ready for spring.
I am as well, Sue. And yes, this is the real Vicki. I’ve discovered a bit of sadness lately that I cannot seem to shake. I think it is because I always feel closer to Mac when I can be outside.
I am sorry you have been sad. Let’s hope spring arrives soon and you can get back to a happy place. Lord knows you deserve it.
Ditto that.
Thank you, both. I will be fine. I know that for sure. We are having a stone patio installed in April. Then I would really love to have a WHW get together here.
Hang in there Vicki .
Thanks SSK. On another topic. Wish you lived closer for spring cleanup š
I know I have like six already lined up starting in April and than my regulars. I bought a trailor and I will be picking it up this Saturday. It’s all registered and set to bring home . Once it’s here I’m going to build it up .
Back and forth, up and down….GEEZ
In any case, the 18Z NAM is back to a suppressed solution for Friday.
http://www.instantweathermaps.com/NAM-php/showmap-conussfc.php?run=2017030818&time=PER&var=ASNOWI&hour=057
I’m really glad that the models provide run-to-run examples of what SAK, JMA, and I say on a regular basis. But what do we know? We just have degrees in the science. š
Yup. Understood. And still we look at the models and we look some more. It has taken years, but I think it is finally sinking in for me that until they get within a couple of days, take their output
with a grain of salt.
Yes I post a gazillion maps with model output, but it is very very rare IF ever, that I say THIS IS WHAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN.
I might wish it and wish it very hard some times, but I don’t say that very often. Once in awhile if I feel strongly I will, but hardly ever.
I love looking at the output. It seems to me this year, more
than ever before there has been so much model discrepancy and run-to-run changes.
JPD – don’t you dare stop posting your models….I would be forced to come find you š We all know that you are not endorsing but you are educating. I would miss them – and your comments – tremendously.
I second what Vicki says JPD!!
Oh, believe me I don’t intend to stop unless expressly asked to do so by TK. I believe I have
his blessing to keep firing away.
I just want it clear that when I post one, even a
“worthless” snow map that Tk and JMA loathe,
does NOT mean that I stand by that map and am certain that the results will materialize (as much as I might want it).
I just like putting it out there that such and such a model thinks this and that will happen. It’s fun.
š
We all know that you are not endorsing but just posting for our pleasure. Thank you, sir!!! It is fun.
Keep posting them. I have no issue with that whatsoever.
DITTO
And in the end the weather will do what it will do.
How true. There’s a saying that I heard long ago that just sticks with me.
There will be weather today whether you like it or not.
Where is that “like” button!
š
Thank you, TK.
Could do without the hype on WBZ FB and elsewhere. Yet, there’s a kernel of truth to the point that it appears that winter’s got himself up off the mat (just when the referee said “7”) and will give spring all he has in the tank the coming 10-14 days: jabs, combinations, and maybe an uppercut.
Time to stock up on the bread & milk. š
As long as it’s not a knock out! š
Where does the NWS come up with this stuff.
Updated snow maps:
LIKELY
http://www.weather.gov/images/box/winter/StormTotalSnowWeb.png
POTENTIAL
http://www.weather.gov/images/box/winter/SnowAmt90Prcntl.png
Dying to see what the GFS has to say about this. š
Winter storm watch for parts of south coast and cape!
WTF!!!
Winter Storm Watch for 4-7 inches? Huh?
That is an advisory level event as far as I am concerned, but hey
they don’t listen to me, do they?
Agree
Won’t be a knock-out, JPDave. Spring will inevitably prevail, but it may take another 10 rounds or so.
18Z GFS snow (Kuchera) for Friday. Yup sure looks like Winter Storm Watch
material to me! NOT! š š š
http://www.instantweathermaps.com/GFS-php/showmap-conussfc.php?run=2017030818&time=PER&var=ASNOWI&hour=054
Pretty tight gradient there. š
Re: Posting the models here.
I look at it as a very positive thing for this reason: The vast majority of people that read this forum (and I mean all readers, not just those that post) have seen enough posts from the met’s here and some others to know the tendencies and biases of models to not buy into too much of what’s there. And I believe those that may be new or inexperienced enough not to realize this will learn from the reminders. As SAK recently stated, forecasters like him and myself were lucky to learn this craft and science when we did, because we were forced to analyze things in much more depth than just looking at computer output and trying to decide what is right and what isn’t. This has such a range of benefits that I could never list them all here, but I will cite one example…
A situation not too long ago (within the last couple winters) arose where every forecast model, and I mean EVERY one, had forecast a warm front to pass through the region after a day of minor accumulating snow. This would have resulted in the snow ending as a few rain showers with temperatures above freezing and a steady and complete melting. SAK and myself, and other mets we knew, in discussing the situation behind the scenes, were entirely unconvinced of this outcome and forecast a period of freezing rain and significant glazing atop the snowcover, basically turning it into a hard crust, and making plowed/shoveled surfaces very glazed and slippery. This indeed turned out to be the case. In fact, the warm air never made it in at all until a Pacific occluded front came through from the west the following night. Every “non-met” weather page in this area got blown out of the water on this one, yet for some reason their followers still found it necessary to tell them they are always “spot on” and better than the actual meteorologists. Really? Tell yourself another lie.
Awesome discussion. I think I remember that, if not that one, something
very similar. š
I know I have a photo I took from the morning. I’ll have to find it and then I’ll know the date.
60KM FIM for Tuesday
https://fim.noaa.gov/FIM/for_web/fim7_jet/2017030812/t3/3hap_sfc_f156.png
Total snow, Includes the little bit for Friday (10:1)
https://fim.noaa.gov/FIM/for_web/fim7_jet/2017030812/t3/totsn_sfc_f198.png
NWS with the Winter Storm Watch for “4-7 inches” for the South Coast for Friday. Not sure I agree here. Oh wait, there’s no self-debate. I don’t agree.
Maybe I don’t know the purpose of a “Winter Storm Watch” but isn’t it more or less a “heads up” for a potential advisory or warning as the timing of the event gets closer and anything below advisory level the “Watch” discontinued altogether?
“Iām really glad that the models provide run-to-run examples of what SAK, JMA, and I say on a regular basis. But what do we know? We just have degrees in the science. ” –TK. this is what environmental scientists and climate scientists deal with all the time. People that are not in the fields acting like they know everything about or putting it out that they know everything about it. Also, I feel climate scientists and meteorologists are two separate things some people do not know all the tools involved since they have not specialized. š I just love this comment as I think all the earth sciences are dealing with this issue. I know its kind of hypocritical of me to say this as I am not a trained met and I have a weather blog, but I state that I am not which I think makes it ok. Something that I have been advocating for in my school is to have a class on scientific writing which includes two parts. One writing the scientific paper in which the science community at hand critiques among themselves and then a piece that is given out to the public that puts it in “simpler words to the public” and use some marker identification that the scientist gets to show that its his/her work and if you do not see these marks you know its fake/ not professional not from a field scientist work. It sucks that it comes down to this but there needs to be some way to have scientist works differentiated between amateurs ( like myself in my blog for meteorology ) and the scientist in the field (TK and SAks blogs). I do have to say some sciences are interdisciplinary so some have parts of others inter-related. That’s my rant š š
Ps the GFS maintains all accumulating snow south of the pike Friday and maintains good snows for Tuesday night/wednesday of next week.
Excellent comment, Matt. All of the comments help to make it clear how many fields experience the same thing
The Winter Storm Watch from the NWS is serving as more of a placeholder than anything. It’ll either be upgraded to a warning, or more likely replaced with a WWA, tomorrow. Or dropped altogether if there’s a big south trend. I’m fine with the issuance, but I don’t understand why it’s only the Cape/Islands and not south coastal RI, where they’re forecasting more snow than in the areas where the Watch is in place.
good points š Rather be on the side of caution than say nothing is going to happen… we all know how that has gotten us š š š
Excellent point of view. Some really great discussion here today
Thanks WxW! That is pretty much what I was asking TK above, but you explained it much better than I. As like you, I don’t have much of a problem with the WSW either. I would, however like TK’s thoughts on it. š
I do, however agree that the watch be restricted to the Cape/Islands only since the storm will be passing by to our south very quickly. Even down there any snow should be done by mid-afternoon.
Today is Wednesday. As a practical matter, predicting actual snowfall for next Tuesday is of course ridiculous. However, I do think it can be fun to watch the models, predictions, and snowfall maps. The real fun is to watch which media outlet will be first to call it a nor’easter. The only problem with all of this is that an unknowing public will take it too seriously too soon.
nor’easter is a storm that mainly affects the northeastern part of the United States. These storms form along the East coast as warm air from over the Atlantic Ocean clashes with arctic cold to the north and west. A nor’easter gets its name from the northeasterly winds that blow in from the ocean ahead of the storm.
any storm with these criteria could be called a nor’easter, does not mean to be a large storm.
Yes, but the media calls any large storm that comes in a nor’easter.
Meanwhile the B’s are playing hockey for keeps!
3 goals in 4 shots over 2:25. Sweet.
The coaching change, which then led to Julien ending up in Montreal has benefitted both the Bruins and Canadiens. I guess one team needed the reigns loosened a bit (Bruins) and the other (Canadiens) needed things tightened up a bit. (Well, that’s my take anyway š )
Been busy with grades closing for trimester 2.
I think I like the 00z NAM for the Friday event and it’s depicted snowfall.
My initial thought for mid next week is that perhaps we could be looking at the longest duration event this winter. Everything else has seemed to be a 6 to 10 hr event, initial trends on this system indicate measurable precip falling for more than 12 hrs ……
Interesting lagging, localized feature the NAM is depicting near the Maine coast.
If anything that storm next week would go further south and east, not further north and west. I just don’t see it at the moment, it is a ways out though so who knows.
It’s now essentially 5 days out so I wouldn’t totally call it a ways out. It’s well within medium range guidance wheelhouse.
Oh my, the 0z GFS is juiced for Friday. 4-7″ at a 10:1 ratio for most of CT, RI, and SE MA!
http://www.tropicaltidbits.com/analysis/models/?model=gfs®ion=neus&pkg=asnow&runtime=2017030900&fh=48
Ugh!
Did the gfs trend east for tuesdays storm?
Yes, 0z GFS went east for Tuesday and just grazes SNE. Still drops 6″ for eastern MA but tails off quickly as you head inland.
Still plenty of time to watch that one, and I’m sure there will be many more run to run model variations over the next few days before the track can be pinned down.
GFS overdone for Friday.
Feeling a strung out system Tuesday and Wednesday. Let’s see if we see a model trend this way.
Strung out, you mean long duration and weaker TK?
To answer your question from earlier about “watch”. They tend to use it that way, but most often it’s the step before a warning. My point here is I don’t think anyone has a shot for warning level snowfall out of the Friday system.
To answer this question, not so much longer duration as the energy a little more stretched out versus being compacted into one super-bomb low pressure area. I’m not sold on either scenario yet, but I’m leaning toward a little more stretching of the low. This may also act to pull the axis of heavier precipitation more to the south than the other scenario.
TK – Can you further explain the proper call for a Winter Storm Watch? WxWatcher and I discussed it above. Thanks.
Hmmm….0Z Euro is also pretty juiced for Friday and looks similar to the GFS with 4-7″ across much of CT, RI, and SE MA. 3″ into Boston metro on both models.
A fair amount of the snow accumulation will occur overnight…we do have that going for us. Will be interesting to see if the NWS expands the WSW in the AM update. Would certainly appear that advisories at least will be warranted roughly along and south of the Pike.
I think both models are over-juiced. Staying low for now. I agree with advisory snow to the south.
0z Euro still drops a foot of snow across much of SNE on Tuesday. System does look a bit more disorganized on this run with the northern energy drawing in some of the energy from the Sunday storm off the southeast coast.
I think the models are trending to what both TK and JMA were advocating.
The GFS after 4 consecutive snow bombs, went Kaplooey and backed off immensely.
The Euro still has near a foot for mostly Wednesday, but looks ragged.
This whole scenario is a testament to proper analysis vs model hugging. We are so lucky to be a part of this blog and get the real deal.
not going to post any snow maps for tues/wed, but will for tomorrow. I find the 4km NAM intriguing.
some maps for tomorrow
32km NMAM (kuchera)
http://maps1.pivotalweather.com/maps/models/nam/2017030906/060/snku_acc.us_ne.png
4km NAM (kuchera)
http://maps3.pivotalweather.com/maps/models/nam4km/2017030906/060/snku_acc.us_ne.png
notice the higher totals stretching nw across eastern ma? some of that is from an inverted trough. interesting.
3km nam (kuchera) does not show inverted trough
http://maps4.pivotalweather.com/maps/models/nam3km/2017030906/060/snku_acc.us_ne.png
gfs
http://maps1.pivotalweather.com/maps/models/gfs/2017030906/048/snku_acc.us_ne.png
My friends, stay weak for Friday- fast moving northern stream shortwaves without deep cold in place, are bound to underperform for their model masters.
NWS discussion earlier this morning
A sharp moisture gradient on the northern edge of the precip
shield along with gradient in frontogenesis adds uncertainty
to the forecast as there will likely be a sharp cutoff north of
the heavy snow area. So any shift in this axis of deep layer
forcing will have a significant impact on snow accum. Highest
confidence of heavy snow is over the Cape/Islands where we will
go with winter storm warnings for 6-8 inches accum. Expanded the
watch across all RI and SE MA where potential for up to 6
inches with best chance along the south coast but will let day
shift have a look at 12z guidance before making warning vs
advisory decision. Winter weather advisories issued north and
west of the watch area across N CT to central and eastern MA
just south of the Mass Pike but confidence in snow amounts is
lower near the Pike. Snowfall amounts will drop off north of the
Pike with only minor accum near the NH border.
nws likey snow map
http://www.weather.gov/images/box/winter/StormTotalSnowWeb1.png
potential
http://www.weather.gov/images/box/winter/SnowAmt90Prcntl.png
minimum
http://www.weather.gov/images/box/winter/SnowAmt10Prcntl.png
CT, RI and south of Boston to me will meet winter weather advisory criteria.
Euro snow for tomorrow
http://imgur.com/a/PeFBg
I have circled the area of troughiness depicted by the 4km nam. this is also the same time snow is depicted in this area.
http://imgur.com/a/0vlq6
Lol- area of troughiness
In the FWIW department, here is the sref 12 hour snow totals
http://www.spc.noaa.gov/exper/sref/gifs/latest/SREF_SNOWFALL_MEAN12HR_f042.gif
ensemble mean snow fo rboston: 4.09 inches.
What’s all the talk about snow for Boston. I think Boston sees snow flying in the air and that works . What is it 6am start time .
New post!